What Ever Happened to Respect for the President?

What's going on, America? Since when is it okay to treat a President with the lack of respect we have witnessed in the past weeks and months?

what the...? Where have been during the Bush admin? Seriously, have you just taken an interest in politics very recently, say since last January 20? It is absolutely astounding that anyone could actually say such a thing except as satire.

Further, the implication that the president would somehow seek to poison the minds of school children is insulting and downright ridiculous.

He doesn't have to seek to poison anything. Neither you nor he believe there is anything he wants to do that is or should be objectionable, so of course you don't understand this.

BUT: the original talk by The Obama contained an exercise or lesson plan for the students, and that started the uproar. The exercise was for the students to write letters to themselves about how they can help the president achieve his goals. (the WH has since retracted this)

Now, if you are a parent who is not agreement with the plans and objectives of the president (I assume that's still okay with you), would you want your kids to be given an assignment to write about how they can help the president achieve his goals?

Not sure? Here, I'll make it easy for you. Imagine the president is Bush and your kid has to figure out how to help him win the war on terror. Liberal, "progressive" that you are, are you okay with that?

(didn't think so.) Did I guess right?

ur right one, i had forgotten about the letter.

kinda arrogant isn't it?

I just googled "Bush = Hitler' to see what pictures they had from the years of the Bush admin-- was respect for the president higher then?

Make up your own mind-- decide for yourself: Here are the results.

Why the disrespect???Richard M Nixon. Gerald Ford. Jimmy Carter. George HW Bush. Bill Clinton.George W Bush. Barack Obama. Need I go on?????

It is dangerous because these are the same seeds of derision that fostered the outbreak of the U.S. Civil War and the same kind of publicly endorsed indignity that allowed the institution of Jim Crow to flourish for so many years in this country. It is dangerous, too, because there is no way in heaven or hell that the American people will stand silently by and allow our nation to ever again descend to such a moral low ground.

This is the basis for the problem. The left seems to feel that ALL disagreement and disrespect for Obama is based upon racial issues. I will concede that some is, much like some for Bush, and other previous white presidents was based on race. "Bush does not like black people." to quote Kanye West on teh Katrina televised benefit. But in this instance by and large the disrespect being displayed towards Obama is based upon the disagreement with the presidents policies and tactics.

He should not be offered any more respect for being black than any other president was offered for being white. President Obama's politics, much like President Bushs politics, are what is driving the lack of respect by the opposition. When the left recognizes that those that oppose him are doing so because they disagree with the direction they feel he is taking the country in they will see that he is being opposed based upon his politics and not his color.

If you wish to discuss the respect level in this country how about addressing the respect for those that are opposing him? The same level that the left said should be shown to those that have opposed previous administrations.

You can try all you wish to hide behind the race card, but when those that oppose Obama do not see his race and only see the make up of his character you will see that he is being treated exactly as MLK wished an African American should be treated. We are paying attention to what he has to say, to what he intends to do, and to the direction he wishes to go; and not his skin color.

This is the basis for the problem. The left seems to feel that ALL disagreement and disrespect for Obama is based upon racial issues. I will concede that some is, much like some for Bush, and other previous white presidents was based on race. "Bush does not like black people." to quote Kanye West on teh Katrina televised benefit. But in this instance by and large the disrespect being displayed towards Obama is based upon the disagreement with the presidents policies and tactics.

Well said.

Obviousy racism is not dead in this country. And I am sure that there are people that hate Obama because of race-- in fact, solely because of race. That's the way racists are...

But-- to claim all opponents of Obama's policies must be racist is nonnsense.Some people jsut have fenuine differences of opinions re policies. (Most Republicans, fro example, tend to have different politcal views on policy than most Democrats-- but htis is regardless of race).

In fact, its a racist style of mannipulation in and of itself to accuse opponents of Obama racist jsut because they have different politcal philosophies..

I will have to agree with "the right" in this instance, and probably not the last time, my answer was going to be, since bush won his second term. Not matter what side of the fence you swing for, disrespecting the "elected by the people" sitting president is disrespecting all the ones who have fought and are still dying for that special of ALL documents.

First of all, if you want to improve the level of dialogue, start by referring to every president as President. As in President Obama, President Bush, President Clinton, etc. All acheived the office, all deserve the title. I noticed in 80s and early 90s when I was in D.C. The Washingotn Post always referred to Presidents Reagan and Bush by their last names, then when President CLinton was elected, they started referring to him by the honorific of President Clinton. Us, as with them, you can't have it both ways. You want to give someone respect, you start with giving all the respect due to the office.

To say that anyone that disagrees with President Obama becuase of his race is a racist, then you must also believe that anyone that sides with the president becuase of his race is also a racist. That disrespect for presidents has been going on since Nixon and possibly before that, but it really hit with Nixon. The MSM fosters this disrespect-look at idiots like Olberman.

I have to agree with 1.1 above-were you suddenly born on January 20th, 2009? How can this suddenly be something to be concerned with? Because your guy is in office now?

http://leaseall.newsvine.com/_news/2009/09/03/3220904-obama-green-czar-calls-republicans-a-holes-">Here is an example of why the level of discourse is so bad. When your representatives act like this, how can you even expect for people to show you respect?

the original talk by The Obama contained an exercise or lesson plan for the students, and that started the uproar. The exercise was for the students to write letters to themselves about how they can help the president achieve his goals.

I did not know this... I, for one, am highly reluctant to compare any American President to other world leaders, but this is the type of thing you would expect from Pongyang, not the White House.

Krishna noted earlier:

I just googled "Bush = Hitler' to see what pictures they had from the years of the Bush admin-- was respect for the president higher then?

Careful, Krishna. A lot of these images may be from Europe, where they really felt Bush was equivalent to Hitler. I think what the "left" is talking about is the amount of "Obama=Hitler/Nazi" references right here in the US.

More specifically for me, it's the amount of it coming from elected officials. It's one thing when private citizens do it, quite another when it's an elected official - some of them are even in the US Congress!

Spikegary, I liked the post idea, BUT, THE GREEN CZAR IS NOT OUR REPRESENTATIVE, he is an employee of Obama, therefore our employee, BUT not our representative as he WAS NOT ELECTED to his job, but hired to meet an agenda. Instead, find links to Franks defending Fannie and Freddie in 2004-5, or Bush the elder promising no new taxes for examples of reasons to disrespect liars and curmudgeons.

Disagreement is fine, but this level of condoned disrespect is ridiculous.

Its not any worse then the left and Dem's gave Bush during his Presidency. I can respect the office... but don't have to respect the man. Especially if he his throwing my young generation and my little kids generation Trillions of more dollars into debt and were going to have to hold the bag on that.

Respect is earn, I had respect for Mr. Obama and even voted for him but he hasn't live up to what he was saying before the election period. Our country is going deep and deeper in debt and all he want to do is spend more and more money, also are allowing 1.5 million people from other countries to come in and take American jobs, plus want amnesty for illegal. He isn't  listening to what the citizens of this country wants all he is doing is telling them I am going to do this no matter what you want. He step in blaming a police officer and stating he was wrong to arrest Gate's without knowing the hold story because Gate was his friend.

Health care is being push on us when it shouldn't be without any type of studies to even see if it would work or not work including the cost for now and ten years down the road.

You do not respect a person just because they are your President, you respect them for who they are or what they do, if he want respect than earn it by doing the right things instead of just pushing something on the citizens of this country. I do not see him working for the citizens of this country and maybe that why people have lost respect for him, I believe he is trying to destroy us from within. He telling Muslins how much they do for this country, and than the government is taking swift company to court because they didn't allow the Muslins to take time off for praying. When did religion enter the work force, after all you are not allow to pray in school.

Has he said what the American citizens has done for this country or with out them and their tax dollars all the other countries wouldn't be getting AID money. The American people do a lot for so many, but we are the bad guy's and our government is putting people from other countries over us. Illegals have more rights in this country than any citizens.

 A person above wrote he can respect the office but not the man, well I can respect either for the person is the office.

Have you never seen an episode of Saturday Night Live?

Have you not listened to Jon Stewart for the last 8 years?

Have you not listened to countless standup comics?

Nixon was called a power hungry egomaniac to his face, many times. Ford was portrayed as a clumsy lout. Carter as an ignorant bumpkin. Reagan was portrayed as a senile old man. Bush 1 as a confused, mumbing idiot. Clinton as a womanizing pot smoking stoner. Bush 2 as an idiot.

Where has the respect for a president been for the last 40 years?

Krishna-

If you wish to discuss the respect level in this country how about addressing the respect for those that are opposing him?

Ok, but first you have to quit denfending people who bring weapons to Presidental events. Threre is no way to rationally discuss or respect anyone who attempts to normalize this abhorrent behavoir.

Remember this phhrase? We don't negotiate with terrorists

You do understand that the horrific "goal" the President wanted the students to achieve was to GET AN EDUCATION! I can see why the GOP would be against this, an ignorant populace is much easier to bully.

I think we need some evidence that the original talk had this letter idea. Where'd that come from, the same people who produced the Kenyan birth certificate?

BUT, THE GREEN CZAR IS NOT OUR REPRESENTATIVE, he is an employee of Obama

He was personally selected to represent President Obama. If the president doesn't want him to talk like that, the President should slap him down, just as any supervisor/manager/boss would do to you or me for bringing embarrassment on an organization. If you want a civil discussion, you need to control those voices that you can before you can expect those you can't control to change their tone/language.

Have you never seen an episode of Saturday Night Live?

Have you not listened to Jon Stewart for the last 8 years?

Have you not listened to countless standup comics?

Nixon was called a power hungry egomaniac to his face, many times. Ford was portrayed as a clumsy lout. Carter as a country lout. Reagan was portrayed as a senile old man. Bush 1 as a confused, mumbing indiot. Clinton as a womanizing pot smoking stoner. Bush 2 as an idiot.

Where has the respect for a president been for the last 40 years?

Let me get this straight, you're equating presidential jokes ( time honored tradition in this country) to people brandishing weapons at Presidential events? Seriously?

If those jokes bother you, politics is not the endevor for you.

What is being discussed here is outright threats to the safety of the President. We're talking about some pissant congressman demanding to vet the President's work. Poisoning children's minds, for and because of, hatred for all things Obama.

Name me one incident where this type of behavior was condoned, sanctioned or promoted by any sitting elected Democratic party officials aimed at derailing an entire presidency.

Of course, the easily controlled have been plied with dis-information about what is contained in the speech/event. These simpletons (sorry, there's no other word for them) are the crux of the problem. Without them the lies and propaganda would just fall to the ground as ridiculous attempts by their purveyors to feather their own beds.

SNL jokes? Really?

Funny, I never heard Bush show any sign of regret for being caught calling a reporter an a@@hole. In fact, Bush supporters whooped it up in glee at the event. Same when Cheney was heard on the Senate floor telling Leahy to "f**k off." Cheney never apologized, was in fact defiant on it. I think this boat has sailed and much longer ago than in our lifetimes. This behavior goes back to our founding days.

Properly expressing rights is not disrespectful, period. Do not confuse respect for the Office with respect for the Man. I still have great respect for the Office of President of the United States of America. I have very little respect for Barry Soetoro. And he has earned every bit of that lack of respect with his beliefs, words and actions.

First, to be fair, I did not vote for Barack Obama. However, I find the hostility directed toward him to be unbelievable.

I honestly feel that there is a segment of the population that, somewhere in their minds, do not recognize Obama as the elected President of the United States. Their words and actions clearly convey their distrust and animosity.

This isn't about healthcare or town hall meetings; the town hall meetings are a clear exercise in free speech, even if we don't always find attendees to be well behaved. I never viewed these debates to be a direct reflection on the public's opinion of the president himself. I'm beginning to believe I misjudged the real motivation for many contrary opinions.

Yesterday, the superintendent of the public schools in my area released a public statement about the upcoming televised speech by the president. The schools here are prohibiting the live broadcast; requiring any teachers interested in showing it later to acquire the approval of the school principal, and provide written consent from the parents of each student.

Since when do we feel we have to protect our youth from the President of the United States? Why are we treating our highest elected official like some type of criminal intent on brainwashing our children? If we are so terrified of what this man believes, why did we elect him president?

As some have pointed out, opponents of Bush displayed the same level of bitterness for choices he made during his presidency. However, no one went so far as to accuse him of trying to corrupt the minds of children in the country he served. We usually reserve that level of vitriol for cult leaders and child molesters.

How about starting with calling the POTUS by his actual name?

That would show that you are capable of some form of respect.

Sitafa-

Great article, best I've read on the Vine in a while

Good job.

Sitafa, I believe that disrespect for the President has been bi-directional. The reasons for the disrespect have varied widely, but the historical record is replete with examples of where those who disagreed with President Bush expressed their opposition in an ugly, unconstructive manner. I have no problem acknowledging that most of the opposition to President Obama - and the disrespectful treatment he has received - comes from vehement differences over policy, amplified by a general, decades-long deterioration in the way we as people express ourselves, and further catalysed by a media establishment that prefers to discuss, describe and depict policy debates as bloodsport. Americans have genuine disagreement over the role of government, its fiscal management and the funding of its activities. Persons on both sides of the issue have heaped such disagreements upon elected officials on personal levels and in unflattering ways.

But whether or not anyone cares to acknowledge it, Sitafa, you and I know that there is indeed a racial dimension to what is going on right now. If not in the existence of disrespectful references, certainly in their specific form. The demonstrations of racial animosity have been consistent:

1. US Representative Lynn Jenkins shared that the GOP was looking for “a great white hope” to counter President Obama and the republicans.
2. In the midst of her campaign for Chair of the Young Republicans Organization, Audra Shay, cheer-led racist comments on her Facebook page. Of course, her subsequent election indicates that the concept of racial harmony will be just as foreign to the current generation of republican political operatives as it was to the last.
3. Michelle Bachmann led other republican politicians in blaming the entire financial meltdown on – you guessed it – racial minorities when she stated that the mortgage debacle that ignited the global crisis was caused by loans “being made on the basis of race and little else”.
4. Republicans in San Bernadino County published a newsletter that included “Obama Bucks”, a food-stamp with pictures of watermelon, fried chicken, ribs and Kool-Aid surrounding a picture of the President.
5. A republican mayor in California distributed e-mails featuring a watermelon patch in the foreground of the White House.
6. A South Carolina republican activist shared on his Facebook page that an escaped gorilla was an ancestor of First Lady Michelle Obama.
7. The United States Commission on Civil Rights issued a report detailing numerous incidents of racially targeted action against African Americans on the part of Florida republicans, many in violation of the Voting Rights Act and Florida law.
8. The Tennessee Republican party distributed a collage featuring pictures of Presidents of the United States, depicting President Obama as two eyes peering out of a black background.
9. The GOP chairman of New Mexico’s Bernalillo County said "The truth is that Hispanics came here as conquerors," he said. "African-Americans came here as slaves” and that "Hispanics consider themselves above blacks. They won't vote for a black president."
10. A republican City Councilman enjoyed racist e-mails regarding the President and the First Lady so much that he thought everyone should have the same fun he was having. So he distributed and forwarded “jokes” that compared Obama to O.J. Simpson while others suggested that "n@!$%r rigs" should now be called "presidential solutions."
11. Chip Saltsman, former chair of the Tennessee republicans and candidate for Chairman of the Republican National Committee, distributed a CD containing the song “Barack the Magic Negro”.

Disturbingly, these are incidents involving elected officials and political operatives. Adding the rhetoric from hate-radio, some of the tea party protesters and some of the posters on forums like Newsvine would create an encyclopedia-sized record of racial discord aimed at this President and his family. So those who take umbrage at your pointing out a racial issue in some of the barbs hurled at President Obama are simply in denial.

Persons uncomfortable with the President addressing American students with an encouraging message of getting the most out of their educational opportunity argue that the President should not have unfettered access to communicate with school children. It does raise an interesting and fair question of what control parents should exercise over who is in contact with their children during the school day. Interestingly, it was never a major issue and subject of national debate until the first African-American President of the United States announced he was going to address America's children. Presidents Bush and Reagan also addressed our nation's schoolchildren with not nearly the level of angst, animosity, vitriol and hatred we have seen over the last couple of days. If I remember, only Congressman Dick Gephardt was registering any significant protest.

Disrespect for the President and the Office of the Presidency has been around for a long time and it is not an exclusive characteristic of any particular segment of the ideological spectrum. There is a new dimension to it this time, however, both in degree and in the situations where the disrespect becomes manifest. Rhetoric from the haters and their apologists here and elsewhere notwithstanding, I will not be cowed into pretending that it doesn't exist. You shouldn't either, Sitafa. Peace.

Seriously, have you just taken an interest in politics very recently, say since last January 20? It is absolutely astounding that anyone could actually say such a thing except as satire.

It's not THAT astounding. There are people who were in middle school during the middle of Bush's stay in the White House, and they probably wouldn't have started caring about politics until recently, and they may not start worrying about it until they're out of whatever university they might choose to go to.

I'm 26. Most people I talk to at work are at least two decades older than I am, and continuously bring up politics from the Clinton era. "Oh, anyone who didn't think Clinton was a sleezeball during the Lewinsky mess is just an idiot" they'd say. Then I'd tell them that I didn't care and ask if they think it's because I'm an idiot, or because I was barely out of junior high at the time.

Honestly, I paid very little attention to any politics until 2005, when I was finally finished with my first degree and had some free time away from books and classes.

Of course, looking at Sitafa's profile picture, she's a bit older than 18-22 (no offense, Sitafa, just guessing).

Jimster- you and all the Bush-bashers calling him a Nazi, screaming that he lied to start a war, claiming that HE was th one to blow up the WTC on 9-11, need I go on?? Please do not get me wrong, I am not a Bush fan, but b!tching that Obama bashing is unfair, racist, and disrespectful while SUPPORTING 8 years of doing the same thing to Bush is not only hypocritical, it is downright stupid. The only reason you are screaming now is because this time it is aimed at Obama. While humor aimed at the president MAY not be dis-respectful, it can, and often has been, stridently partisan. Poking fun at Gerald Ford falling down all the time (Chevy Chase, SNL skits too many to mention) was funny, and based on truth. Listening to "comedians" such as Wanda Sykes, Chris Rock, and others screech about how Bush should be assasinated is not. Was Chase anti- Ford? I don't know, and it was irrelevant. Sykes and Rock have repeatedly stated that they hated Bush. Instead of being funny to all, supporters of bush and detractors, as The Chase skits were, no one who is not a raving leftwing nut can find anything funny in their rants.

Sitafa

Your memory is very short term. How do you think we all treated Bush Jr?

Have a nice day.

*Raises his beer to Neale Osborn*

Good post!

Disagreement is fine, but this level of condoned disrespect is ridiculous.

HA! Why? Where were you during the Bush 1, Bush 2, and Reagan administrations?

Which one are you? The pot or the kettle. You just respect him because he fits your ideology. You don't have to admit that, it's pretty obvious from your article.

When the Repubs. are in office they DEMAND respect for the POTUS,but when a Democratic POTUS who will uphold the Constitution and do what is best for us all is in power then it becomes a no-holds barred maniacal free for all in which no lie is above throwing at the POTUS or any who support him. The right has shown it's TRUE colours and exactly what little they stand for. It is quite obvious that the Repubs. are nothing more that a bunch of corporate whores who will fight the American people to keep the Corporate Bund in ultimate power.

Hey Cat, wth are you smoking?

How is he upholding the Constitution?

He didn't get rid of the patriot act bush brought on us, he renewed it.

I think you need to shed your bias and get your facts straight before you post, this love affair you libs have is sickening.

Jeff, whatever I'm smoking it does not contain the hallucinogenic components that you obviously use yourself. Oh wait you don't use drugs your just hooked on the opiate of the masses! the Republican/Conservative propaganda laced with lies. The trouble is that withdrawal from your addiction means that you must look at the world through open eyes and admit that you have a problem, then and only then can you take the steps to remove the toxins from your cranium.

FYI i'm an independent, so your cute attempt at trying to denounce a republican/conservative is lost on me.

i noticed you made no attempt to argue the fact obama DID in fact renew the patriot act, so again HOW is he upholding the Constitution?

If you can't answer it, say so, but don't try and dodge the question and act coy, you're not very good at it.

And BTW...Coy is a fish

It would help when correcting someone to be correct yourself:

coy: 1 a : shrinking from contact or familiarity <'tis but a kiss I beg, Why art thou coy? — Shakespeare> b : marked by cute, coquettish, or artful playfulness
2 : showing reluctance to make a definite commitment <a coy response>

Not to be confused with koi, a large goldfish-like carp often found in ornamental ponds. Or were you "fishing" for an argument?

Respect is earned, not something automatic for any politician. In the beginning a spoke of Obama with respect and sometimes I still do that, but frankly he has not earned my respect for the following reasons?

1. He has lied and used scare tactics in the debate about healthcare and then spoken out against similar actions that are not favorable to healthcare reform.
2. He promised that the stimulus bill would not contain pork and it is full of pork.
3. He ran as a uniter and he has been a divider
4. He tries to promote his agenda for tax increases by creating class warfare and he has been dishonest with respect to how he describes some supposed "tax loopholes."
5. He states that he wants bi-partisan efforts, but then he is unwilling to compromise to to promote the spirit of compromise.
6. He has allowed the Dem party to turn a deaf ear towards half the the population's concerns about healthcare reform
7. He has created the largest deficit in the history of the country.

When he starts listening to my concerns, stops creating division (that is not what a true leader does), and actually treats me as a citizen of this country, then he will earn my respect.

With respect to ugly disparagement of the President, there is no side with clean hands and there are persons on both ends of the ideological spectrum with curiously short memories. Unless we have tried to put in check those who have engaged in such behaviour who also happen to share our opinions on policy and ideological issues, we are guilty of hypocrisy. That includes me. I have given a pass to personally disparaging and disrespectful words about President Bush that I would not want said about President Obama and I would be surprised if there were anyone on the Vine who didn't live in a similar glass house.

That said, I do note differences in degree, level of hostility and ubiquity of the situations where such rhetoric occurs and the sheer number of people doing it. For instance, the level of animosity directed at George Bush for formally addressing students nowhere near approaches the idiotic response to President Obama's planned address. I also note differences in the content of the disparagement which in the case of President Obama, the First Lady and their children has become decidedly racial (see 1.26).

Sorry, I tried to make changes to my post, but it didn't save. Here's what my post should have said:

coy: 1 a : shrinking from contact or familiarity<'tis but a kiss I beg, Why art thou coy? — Shakespeare> b : marked by cute, coquettish, or artful playfulness
2 : showing reluctance to make a definite commitment <a coy response>

Perhaps you were thinking of Koi - a large goldfish-like carp, often used in ornamental pods. Or perhaps you were simply "fishing" for an argument.

Well I am very tired of people trying to make the case that since I disagree with and have no respect for Barack Obama then I must be a racist. Of course I can disagree with him all I want and for any reason. But I will tell you why I do not respect him. Barack Obama stands against almost every value I hold dear. From his actions it is apparent to me that there is no trick to dirty for him to use. He would tell any lie he thought would get him what he wants.

I do not respect Obama because he does not respect my values.

I respect the office of the Presidency but not the man who currently sits in the office.

The only thing that race has to do with this is that we constantly have to listen to the excuses from the left that if he were white then everything would be OK.

Racist abound on the left as they have always done.

I've read the papers written and heard the words spoken by Mark Lloyd, Van Jones and Cass Sunstein. These people are certainly entitled to their views. No big deal there.

The fact that they are all appointed by Obama and now hold Federal positions = a big deal.

Has any pro-Obama person listened to or read the words of these appointees?

@fedupwithliberals:

Or perhaps you were simply "fishing" for an argument.

I think he was going for the homophone of "coy" and "koi" - it would have made more sense when heard rather than read.

It's not our duty to respect the president. It is not our duty to help him do his job, he has advisors for that. It is our duty to uphold and defend the Constitution and the Bill of Rights (just as it is his), to defend our country and to hold all those who hold political office accountable to the people. They are our servants, not the other way around.

Dave -- Obama ran as a "uniter" in the sense he wanted to reach across the aisle and push bi-partisan legislation through for the benefit of all Americans. Beginning with his first week in office, he hosted GOP Congressional members in order to set the tone for future legislation. In these meetings the GOP stated that they would be willing to work with this president on an economic plan. But, what did they do? Those in the GOP gave him a kick in the pants!!! This began their plan to promote anything from his office as "socialist" "marxist" "communist" and proved to be obstructionists in the democratic process with the sole agenda of making any of Obama's issues his "waterloo." And they have been bold in publicly stating this fact. How can you expect their constituents to show respect for Obama when those elected GOP congressional members do not show a modicum of respect themselves?

The GOP lied, and used scare tactics, about the stimulus plan and they are lying, and using the same scare tactics, about the health insurance reform legislation in order to ensure their handing this Democrat president a political policy failure. The GOP does not care about what may be good for this country. They are placing their political ideology first, country last!!!!! I am ashamed how they are maligning their president!!!! I am ashamed at how elected officials are on the verge of subverting the government!!!!! I am ashamed that GOP officials are pushing the far rightwing nut agendas of the "birthers," the "teabaggers," and the "death panel" crowds. I am ashamed that the GOP is fueling the flames of hatred, bigotry, and ignorance in their party just to prove that they can flex their muscles and bring down a sitting president. Those in the GOP own it to their COUNTRY FIRST to defend the democratic process and tell their constituents the truth. The GOP needs to show their true American patriotism and take these travelling circus freak shows to task by telling them the truth and silencing their outrageous lies and false propoganda. As long as the GOP congressional members remain silent, they show their complicity in whatever the outcome of these fringe nut groups are.

I, for one, did not like Dubya or his policies. But, as I have stated time and time again, I never once hoped for his policies to fail. Because his failures would make our country weaker. I always hoped and prayed that Dubya's policies would first do no harm to our country. Unlike these current rightwingnuts that call for the complete failure of Obama's policies. And these wingnuts have the nerve to call themselves patriots? These far right fringe groups and those elected officials that openly support their agenda are not true Americans, not true patriots!!!

Here's an idea -- let the Texas successionists succeed and then all of you that hate Obama can give up you US citizenship, move to the Republic of Texas and become true "republicans" and then you can have your own country of gun-ownership, a theocracy that forces you to adhere to the one and only Christian conservative religion, have no socialized healthcare of any kind (which means those seniors giving up your Medicare), and have no socialized retirement fund, which means no social security checks. I hope you enjoy life under the Christian Taliban!!!!!!

Ask Republicans what happened to respect for the President.

As much as many Democrats hated Bush (and were virtually removed to adjoining states to "safely protest" his criminal policies), we followed legal recourse and did not try to shut the government down (like Republicans in 1994 and today).

Entitled as you are to your opinion, Mark, it would have more credibility if it were backed up by facts. You make a lot of charges, each one easily exposed as false if not for the time it would take, so lets look at one for now:

He has created the largest deficit in the history of the country

This is both factually incorrect and ignorant of the nation's current situation. President Obama hasn't created any deficit yet. The FY2009 budget we are currently operating under is President Bush's last budget. You would be correct if you said that the Obama Administration was proposing a budget that - if implemented fully - would result in the largest deficit in history. But that hasn't happened yet as Congress has not yet taken up the budget for approval. Bush still holds the crown.

Further, the increase in the deficit results from three factors:

1. Our economy has been in a recession since December of 2007, which has resulted in a massive decrease in tax receipts while our non-discretionary and essential commitments budget commitments (military, interest on debt, etc.) must remain the same or increase. Blaming President Obama for this is disingenuous to put it charitably.
2. The President has proposed extension of President Bush's middle class tax cuts and has added his own. If he did away with those, the deficit would be smaller, but you would have added that as one of your reasons to dislike him. I find that most of the President's critics lack credibility because they criticise him regardless of the choice.
3. The 2010 budget includes continued economic stimulus. The Administration's critics demonstrate a self-serving forgetfulness by not acknowledging the dire financial crisis that greeted the President on the day he walked into the Oval Office. The critics ignore the most basic tenets of how governments must respond to economic displacement by stepping in with stimulus when consumers and business stop spending. If you want to bash President Obama for the deficit, then you must be comfortable with the continuance of a moribund economy.

There is similar, fact-based rebuttal to each one of your points, Mark. Suffice to say, however, that your opinion is based on highly specious reasoning.

I don't have a problem with people disagreeing with the President--ANY President. That's fine. I don't assume all of those who disagree are racist.

However, I have a severe problem with the hate and fearmongering often employed in these "disagreements." I have a problem with willful misrepresentation of facts (death panels, anybody? End of life care doesn't mean death panels--it means health care directives/living wills, etc.) I have a problem with signs that say death to the president and praying for his death.

I will listen to any REASONED argument. That means it's based on actual facts--not what some news pundit said was fact, but actual fact. I actually enjoy a good, informed debate that is based on these actual facts. But lately, I see/read too much misinformation in so-called news outlets. It frustrates the heck out of me.

I don't agree with everything any President has said or done. I agree with some. I disagree with others. And I dislike certain past Presidents more than others because of certain actions they took. That's just the way life is. But no matter what, I realize that our nation has been one of the most free societies in the world, and I treasure that and don't want to lose it. That's why all this misinformation and hatred and preying on people's fears bothers me so much--it threatens our freedom by making us puppets in the political realm.

To those who say the author is ignoring the President Bush was treated disrespectfully, please notice that she said "The last 8 years" in her article. I feel that like me she probably wasn't comfortable with the way that President Bush was treated during that time, even if she didn't agree with him.

I will say this though, the disrespect is escalating. When Bush spoke to students in the US I don't remember there being this large of an out cry of "He's trying to brain wash our children!". The article that you are speaking of that the students were suppose to write about "How they could help the President" was a suggested exercise for the students to do after the video was shown, it was not mandatory that the teachers make them do such. This is the type of thing that I know I was made to do when we had a public speaker come to our school when I was in High School. I was made to right a short paper on "How can I help keep kids off of drugs" after a police officer came to my school and I also had to right "What can I do to help educate people on AIDS" after a school lecture on that. This was the same kind of situation, they were just writing exercises.

You see, its things like this that the media throw out to make us miss the real issues. This is almost as bad as the 3 days of coverage on the fact that President Obama used Mustard on his burger instead of Ketchup! Lets stick to the real issues, because there are plenty, and quit getting lost in the useless crap!

A very thoughtful piece, Sitafa. Those guilty of the transgressions you refer to will never understand your position, nor will they be capable of accepting their roles in these acts. Those on the 'fringe' will attack your views and state that Obama isn't treated any differently than any other sitting President. They just won't get it. However, your words are not lost on the masses -- those who do not necessarily blog, but are prone to well-reasoned thoughts and ideas. You may not hear from them, but they're out there. The crazies that mindlessly rant in cyberspace and at town meetings represent a small faction of America -- fortunately. Thanks for speaking up!

I will say this though, the disrespect is escalating.

Proof!

What about those who say GWB created 9/11?

What about the claims GWB was spreading fascism in the schools?

What about the claim GWB was racist because of Katrina? (For the record, the Mayor of New Orleans is about as intelligent as a rock and didn't do HIS job)

So it's okay to question GWB and even create lies about him but questioning Obama's lesson plan as perhaps being partisan manipulation is NOT okay? Whatever. Some people are simply devout Obamabots.

http://pol.moveon.org/petraeus.html

haha you baby libs, its been a few months with obama in. he sucks, get used to us not liking him.

Sitafa,

In my 20s (1972) I could almost say that my President got (almost) himself impeached.

This was, for my generation, something from Government or History Classes, I think President Johnson (the one who followed Linclon) was in the record books for American History.

By 1998, I was finally able to say that my President got himself impeached.

Where Nixon was unsuccessful in getting himself impeached, President Clinton succeeded.

These events went far in lowering the lofty dignity of the office and, possibly the person - whatever the name, gender, race.

Careful, Krishna. A lot of these images may be from Europe, where they really felt Bush was equivalent to Hitler. I think what the "left" is talking about is the amount of "Obama=Hitler/Nazi" references right here in the US.

Nice try-- but no cigar!

I myself have personally seen numerous Bush = Hitler references in the US. And I would imagine you have to. Or-- have you been living in a cave somewhere-- just totally unaware of cuurent affairs during the Bush years-- or trying to mislead us?

Can you honestly say that you haven't seen this sort of thing in the U.S.?

.

You get what you give

ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91WgM6dNLTE

SpoxLogic

Krishna noted earlier:

I just googled "Bush = Hitler' to see what pictures they had from the years of the Bush admin-- was respect for the president higher then?

Careful, Krishna. A lot of these images may be from Europe,

Here are just a few example, by anwriter/photographer living the the San Francisco area (which is, of course, part of the U.S.)> i could link to all of these sepaarsately, but it easier to jsut link to the main page-- if you're interested you can look at the numerous examples he/she linked to):

Bush as Hitler, Swastika-Mania: A Retrospective

You get respect when you earn it.

Fedup withsmart people...liberals..Yes I know what the word coy is and it's uses and how to spell the fish too.Sometimes some comments are so fantastically ridiculous and childish that you must reply in kind! You dem.and lib haters are deplorable people who quite frankly do not deserve a civil or cogent response. grow up please or just become a Democrat! either one will suffice.

Cat-

I resent this remark, i have not in this discussion brought anything resembling:

"...fantastically ridiculous and childish..."

and as stated in #1.33 you STILL haven't defined HOW Obama is defending the constitution, as you claimed earlier.

Growing up, as you claim means to admit your mistakes, as well as clarifying your responses, like an adult, not just shrugging your shoulders and hoping the question goes away. THAT is childish.

Pot, meet kettle.

You get respect when you earn it.

Sometimes.

But, not always the case in partisan politics!

You dem.and lib haters are deplorable people who quite frankly do not deserve a civil or cogent response

Funny thing - I don't hate dems or libs; as my screen name spells out, I'm fed up with liberals. There aren't too many people on this earth I would ever claim to hate.

grow up please or just become a Democrat!

So you're admitting there's a difference? :)

Sitafa Harden,

You have it wrong,

Isn’t being elected president achieving the highest level of respect from the American people?

In US Politics, it’s maintaining the respect by bringing both parties together to provide legislation that benefits all Americans. Skilled leaders overcome these obstacles, but it’s too earlier….to make any real assessment.

Isn’t being elected president achieving the highest level of respect from the American people?

I'm guessing United States Senator James Inhofe (R-OK) didn't vote for President Obama.

And how many death threats did Bush have in his first year in office just because he was a n####r?  It didn't hit the fan for Bush until he lied his butt off to get war powers to invade Iraq, AN IMPEACHABLE OFFENSE.  How many legislators vowed to slit their wrists because Bush was visiting schools? Did Bush do town hall meetings over Iraq and people show up with loaded weapons, effigies to burn, spray cans for swastika grafitti? Bush Republicans pushed through the Medicare Drug Benefits, a corporate welfare bill to make billionaire Pharm Corps trillionaires with no one calling it socialism or un American.

The bottom line is the rest of us had to endure 8 long years of one of the most unpopular presidents in our history.  And now Republicans are throwing a tantrum after 8 months because they can't elect another Bush - Cheney ticket .   They are running around like Chicken Little screaming the sky is falling. 

Get a grip!!!

Never before has a president of these United States been the target of such derision and hatred. Never.

The conservatives here on Newsvine may talk as though they are near or at a majority, but I believe before too long, the nation that voted president Obama into office will once again turn towards the hate from the right and relegate it to the roughly 21% that the hate emanates from.

Call us "liberals", "socialists", whatever you like, but we are the majority middle class that built this nation, and Barack Obama is our president.

My sincere hope is that if all the anti president Obama nuts here on Newsvine that rant and rave against him are that unhappy with who and how we have elected our president, that you all will move to the Republic of Texas, and stay there.

Spare me the "outrage" you claim to feel. You are domestic terrorists that need to be dealt with appropriately. Al Queda never had a better ally than the conservative Republican party.

The President has to be worthy of respect, which this one clearly is not. While I think that it would be fun to have a beer or two with Mr. Obama, he is even more of a disaster as a President than I feared. And, there is absolutely nothing wrong with saying that in public. I very much hope that there will be sufficient change in Congress following the 2010 election so that Mr. Obama can be impeached and removed from office, before he does any more damage to this country.

We have just finished 8 years of the most vituperative slander directed at President Bush. At Mr. Obama's inauguration, Mr. Bush was treated with the most astonishing rudeness. You can not endlessly impugn the sitting President, without tarnishing the office also.

To a large extent, the diminishment of the Presidency itself has been accomplished by the left, who now want to complain that since their guy holds the office, that he should be treated with deference and respect.

Cat: I don't think that the Constitution has been enforced since the New Deal. FDR rendered it moot, via the intimidation proffered via his "court-packing" scheme, to checkmate the Justices who kept ruling his programs unconstitutional.

How was president Bush "treated with the most astonishing rudeness"??

I watched the entire process, and don't recall anything like that.

Never before has a president of these United States been the target of such derision and hatred. Never.

No, I never heard a disparaging word about Bush. Or Reagan. And the Vice President is above such attacks, like Cheney was spared by the left.

Maybe it is because Obama provoked the American people with his unwarranted apologies to our enemies and implementation of Marxist policies and his mindless bigoted statements about race and police and capitalism and freedom and liberty.

You have illustrated my point beautifully, and repugnantly.

Thanks.

I just love mental blindness. All of these "liberals" hating the "conservative" for following the liberal tactic of personal attack is simply hilarious. Bush did so much wrong, but the one thing you can say is that no more terrorist attacks from Islamic jihadists reached our shores after we started kicking A S S in Iraq. Do I approve of the rest of his plans, like Homeland Security, the Patriot act, etc? NFW. His stance on the border, abysmal. I opposed him every time he screwed up. And now, I will continue to do the same whenever the current buffoon in the Whitehouse does something I dis-approve of. This is called being an active citizen. When/if Obama does something worthy of respect, HE WILL GET IT. As long as he pushes a socialist agenda, roams the world apologizing for America being forced into the position of world policeman (because everyone else is too lazy), and giving America the blame for everthing wrong on planet earth while absolving our enemies and allies of all guilt for their copious portion thereof, HE WILL GET NONE. Nor will he deserve any.

You have illustrated my point beautifully, and repugnantly.

Glad to help. I knew you couldn't do it on your own, being a liberal and all.

OK - for all you tin-foil hatters who think BO will indoctrinate our children - READ this excerpt of PRESIDENT Reagan's speech to our nation's children, carried live on C-SPAN on November 14th, 1988 to our nation's classrooms:

That's a big argument that's going on in government. And I definitely believe it is because one of the principal reasons that we were able to get the economy back on track and create those new jobs and all was we cut the taxes. We reduced them because, you see, the taxes can be such a penalty on people that there's no incentive for them to prosper and earn more and so forth because they have to give so much to the Government. And what we have found is that at the lower rates the Government gets more revenue. There are more people paying taxes because there are more people with jobs. And there are more people willing to earn more money because they get to keep a bigger share of it.

President Ronald Reagan's Speech, carried by the Instructional Television Network, and C-SPAN, to mark the beginning of the ANNUAL American Education Week. You can read the full transcript here.

How are Reagan's words NOT political, but President O'Bama's speech that will reportedly ask students to do well and study hard, brain-washing?

In October of 1991 - ONE MONTH BEFORE ELECTION DAY - in an address broadcast live on CNN and PBS and carried to the nation's classrooms - President Bush delivered his own speech to our nations school-aged youth. From the Dallas Morning News:

In his speech, Bush extolled the virtues of studying, avoiding drugs and staying out of trouble. "What's so great about being stupid?" he said.

Records at his presidential library at Texas A&M show that the speech was broadcast live on CNN and public television, along with some radio networks.

Like the current education secretary, Arne Duncan, Bush's education chief, Lamar Alexander – now a senator from Tennessee – had sent letters to every school in the country urging them to let students watch the president speak.

Democrats blasted Bush for spending nearly $28,000 from the Education Department budget to hire a TV crew – apparently to ensure a more polished production than the networks would have ponied up for.

Alexander was forced to defend the expenditure at a congressional hearing: "We don't send messages by smoke signals anymore. ... We do it by microphone and camera," he said.

Democrats complained about $28,000. You chicken-littles scream the sky is falling. And you're fomenting revolution. You know it just like the rest of of us know.

Obama IS the President of the United States of America. Say it with me now - Obama is the duly-elected President of the United States of America. So I ask - If the question on the accompanying teaching aid read "How do we help America?" instead of "How do we help the President of the United States?" what's the difference?

What I expect you'll say is that Obama/Nobama/HeilBama is a socialist/fascist/tyrant/Muslim/illegal immigrant - take your pick. What EYE say is you (you and your Republican cohorts) have stooped to a low most of us didn't see coming.

Did we demonize Bush over the war? Eventually. We did so when it became clear he and Cheney lied us into war. Up until that point, however, we generally supported him. With BO, however, you and your ilk, abetted by Fixed News, have sounded a 24/7 drumbeat of socialist/fascist/tyrant/communist rants since Inauguration Day, every time he opened his mouth. It's never mattered to you what he was saying or why he was saying it. Kinda like we were between the time Bush won in the Supreme Court in 2000, and 9/11/2001. But we came together.

You want the majority of this nation - those of us who voted for this President - to be blinded by your hypocrisy. You now claim that carrying a gun to a Presidential event is your Constitutional right (oh, how far you've come from owning a gun to protect your home and your family).

I dun thin so Lucy. You have taken to maligning every single individual with whom you find disagreement. You shout down and attack those you oppose. Senators, Congressmen/Congresswomen - and yes - now you what to silence our President when he wishes to speak to school children.

For months, I have refused to believe those who said that BO's critics were somehow racist. Now I see THE most disgusting element of these past 7 months is hatred of the President. While you all claim your opposition is based upon policy - not race - never have we seen in the 230 years of this Republican such vitriol and base hatred, tinged with racism, coming from rabid Republicans.

You've poisoned the well. But remember - that's your water too. You should ALL be ashamed of yourselves.

Randy from Maine.

Great comment Randy!

So Reagan didn't ask the kids to help him and read books about him? So Bush didn't ask the kids to help him and read books about him?

Bush and Reagan loved America. Obama hated America, from day one, from at least 20 years ago when he chose to get his learrning from the Reverend Wright. Obama is a narcissistic, megalomaniacal, bigoted, Marxist, America hater. That is why he has no place in America's schools or even the Presidency.

SITAFA HARDEN

I am ashamed that President Obama is being treated this way, but I am also immensely grateful that he is strong enough to bear this burden for all of us. Thank you, Mr. President, and please watch your back.

I too question how after two stolen elections and 8 years of disaster while our President rescues our country from another Great Depression. I just don't know what to say.....?

To Newsvine participants:

The Capitalist is censoring me by deleting comments that are 100% appropriate.

Please stop this, Capitalist.

Let the "free market" of ideas flourish.

Randy207

Me and the wife just left West Bath Maine for Florida. I'm staying but where abouts in Maine are you at? Friend request on the way.

He doesn't have to seek to poison anything. Neither you nor he believe there is anything he wants to do that is or should be objectionable, so of course you don't understand this.

BUT: the original talk by The Obama contained an exercise or lesson plan for the students, and that started the uproar. The exercise was for the students to write letters to themselves about how they can help the president achieve his goals. (the WH has since retracted this)

Now, if you are a parent who is not agreement with the plans and objectives of the president (I assume that's still okay with you), would you want your kids to be given an assignment to write about how they can help the president achieve his goals?

Not sure? Here, I'll make it easy for you. Imagine the president is Bush and your kid has to figure out how to help him win the war on terror. Liberal, "progressive" that you are, are you okay with that?

Just as I thought: more ignorance, less openness.

Here is a question for all you conservatives, (and I'm afraid some liberals): Is there any reason to disrespect a US President? Whether sitting or retired, a president should have respect.

Not when they have attacked private citizens like obama has done.

Not when they have spent their entire adult life in anti-American groups, and anti-white groups, like obama has.

Sitafa,

You sound like Obama should go on SNL with an "I don't get no respect shtick."

Except Rodney Dangerfield was funny.

Obama and his followers are downright scarey, running the country through 40+ unelected czars, supressing free speech, biting off the opposition's fingers, intimidating voters in paramilitary outfits, beating up conservatives, showing up at rallys with semiautomatic weapons etc. In the words of Obama/ Pelosi/ Reid we are "stupid," "NAZIs" and "dumb as table tops."

Not respectful.

Not funny.

I have far more respect for Rodney.

He earned it.

President Obama has "attacked private citizens"? Has spent his "entire adult life in anti-American groups"???

Your claims are exactly why they are seen as ridiculous right wingnut rhetoric. Lies.

Fortunately, these wacky claims, perpetuated by the likes of Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachman, Glenn Beck and the other high volume hatemongers are beginning to wear very thin on the national conscience, and will result in even worse election results next time around. You're pushing the right's voice ever further to the right.....off....the....map.

Keep it up. The Democratic party can't buy that kind of publicity.

The left doesn't seem to understand where the mistrust for Obama comes from.

The people against Obama believe he holds un-American values. They believe some of his czars favor affirmative action over free speech and the free market (Mark Lloyd). They believe that Cass Sunstein doesn't want the First Amendment to "get in the way" of public policy.

They believe that the bailouts, clunkers and health care represent an unimaginable increase in government.

Van Jones. Did he leave because he had an affair? Did he leave because he robbed a store when he was 15? Note how either reason would have nothing to do with how he advises the President.

Van Jones left because of his radical political views.

The above sentence is 100% on point when it comes to casting suspicion on Obama's czars, and thus Obama himself. Obama hand-picked this guy. He wasn't some random off the street.

I certainly hope that people don't forget why Obama appointed him in the first place.

This core suspicion of Obama's mindset is why you saw a national revolt about the address to school kids. It's also why the other czars will be looked at. The papers they've written, the words they've said. Some people who've bothered to look already know.

When you have been taught, and you in turn have taught your children that Black people are inferior to white people.

Does it matter if that black person is President of the United States and worthy of your respect?

I have seen Black Lawyers, Judges and Doctors treated like shyt by lowly white police officers, mechanics or sanitation workers, if this surprises you then you don't get out into the real world very much.

Many white people regardless of their circumstances in life, no matter how poor and uneducated they are, still feel that their white skin makes them superior to any black person in America.

Even the first African American President of the United States of America.

Rickeroo

You talk a lot about "suspicion", "Mistrust", "Beliefs", and the "mindset" of president Obama, as if you know what he's thinking, and then top it off with the false assertion that there is / was a "national revolt" against his upcoming address Tues. night. I doubt you'd ever recognize a "national revolt" if you consider the tempest in teabag this latest smear campaign to be one.

A hand full of G.O.P. hardliners with the help of a lazy media have tried to foment another "swift boating" event against president Obama. It will die an anonymous death just like the Astroturfers "national revolt" did just last month.

Krishna @ #1.3,

I just googled "Bush = Hitler' to see what pictures they had from the years of the Bush admin-- was respect for the president higher then?

Google returned:

Results 1 - 10 of about 1,370,000 for bush = hitler. (0.19 seconds)

Results 1 - 10 of about 8,110,000 for obama=hitler. (0.10 seconds)

Apparently it took Bush 8 years to rack up his results and Obama only 9 months!

Scary huh?

AZPADDY:

have tried to foment another "swift boating" event against president Obama

They sure did manage to "swift boat" that lesson plan though, huh? It also went from being shown in every classroom to parental/student opt out, or by teachers to broadcast in the classroom options in most of the country. I guess "revolts" do work after all.

I know the people worshiping the ground President Obama walks on feel that every word out of his mouth is honet to be lapped up without question, but I think I will continue to be a skeptic for a while longer.....

Respect is earned.

What happened to respect for the President? It went by the wayside when we started electing by narrow margins inexperienced ideologues who lied to us, looked for ways to subvert the Constitution rather than abide by it, and handed over the keys to the country to multinational corporations, investment banks, and foreign interests.

That's a damned good question, what kind of respect did Reagan get, Bush 41, Bush 43............. and for that matter did W. J. Clinton do anything to garner respect for the office????????

C. K. 1.93

Your hatred of president Obama along with that of your confederates only serve to elevate his image among the majority of the nation's voters that elected him.

This latest attack against our president will roll off his back like water off a duck's back. Past "national revolts" have faded as quickly as they appeared, as all "phony outrage" events do.

Townhall "revolts"? gone

The "national outrage" against president Obama's speech to children? Gone.

The "national outrage" re his Birth certificate? Gone.

The "furor" about "Death panels"? Gone.

What other swift boat-like attacks await our president?

God only knows, but they will have little to no effect. Lies seldom do.

Thanx, azpaddy, for upholding respect and calling down the disrespectful.

Funny how everything you mentioned on your list there was changed or scaled back because of us "disrespectful" voters.

Just so we are clear on who I hate, it is every crooked, double dealing, lying, cheating, stealing politician so no your Saviour is not alone or even special to me. He's just another example. Now to the question at the top of the article:

What Ever Happened to Respect for the President?

• It's overseas with the troops waiting to come home from a war over oilfields.
• It's waiting for a transparent government
• It's waiting for a balnanced budget
• It's waiting for a congress free of special interest control
• It's waiting for ethics reform
• It's waiting for prosecution of employers of illegal aliens
• It's waiting for Universal Healthcare and sound Social Security
• It's waiting for exposure of corruption and the prosecution of those involved
• It's waiting for a tax system that is fair without loopholes for the rich
• It's waiting for new faces in the cabinet instead of the same old crooked ones
• It's waiting for a REAL Leader

You want my respect, then show me you are part of real "change" from the past. Meanwhile, I'll continue to voice my opposition to business as usual even if it is against Congress or a President who would make a great used car salesman....

storyartist

Thank you!

C.K.

I visited a memorial to the victims of 9-11 yesterday and walked among thousands of American flags with a laminated postcard of the name and brief outline of the person's life on each one. President Obama has shifted the "war on terror" to where it should have been as soon as he could. I hope you don't consider the war in Ahfganistan to be a "war over oilfields". That would be an insult to every innocent man, woman and child's name I stopped to read there.

The trillions of wasted dollars in a senseless war in Iraq has added untold hurt to our nation along with abandoning the hunt for Bin Laden.

You list what it would take to become "perfect" for any nation. We finally have a president that is hard at work to cure a crippled nation, and you ctitisize his efforts because they haven't brought about perfection in 8 months??

Instead of joining in the unholy chorus of hate, join the effort to rebuild America to our once great status and support the president that America elected. You cynically refer to president Obama as my "saviour", but have nothing constructive to add to the debate.

Respect starts within. Practice it.

AZPADDY: Ditto my last comment.

Would you think about expanding your comment #1.101 into a short article to post on Newsvine? Right now we could use your wisdom to give us a place to rally!

Thanks for the compliment!

Time permitting, I'll post an article. There are a lot more of pro-president of the United States voters than there are cynical confederates bent on tearing down our president. While we're busy with our families and jobs, and aren't able to fly to D.C. to demonstrate, we are the majority, and we did elect Barack Obama for president.

We may not be as vocal or strident as the anti American crowd in D.C. this weekend, but then again, we aren't motivated by the emotions of racial hatred and intolerance either.

Have faith. We and our president will prevail despite the efforts of the confederates to overthrow our government.

Have faith. We and our president will prevail despite the efforts of the confederates to overthrow our government.

AZPADDY and storyartist,

Questions:

1. Do you support corrupt government?
2. Do you think the Constitution is outdated and therefore non-binding?
3. Do you think Congress is capable of policing itself?
4. Do you think that because a person is President it is un-American to voice opposition?

C'mon, C.K.

4. Constant verbal attacks, showing up armed at presidential events, calling the president a liar on national television, referring to the president - daily - as a "socialist", "Marxist", "used car salesman", is a very very far cry from simply "voicing opposition".

1. Who in the world supports corrupt government?

2. Who said the constitution is outdated and non-binding?

3. Congress is policed by "we the people". Did you vote?

If you're going to debate the issues, use fact and logic.

Is it really asking too much to support our president? Is that really an outdated, and non-binding concept??

4. Do you think that because a person is President it is un-American to voice opposition?

4. Constant verbal attacks, showing up armed at presidential events, calling the president a liar on national television, referring to the president - daily - as a "socialist", "Marxist", "used car salesman", is a very very far cry from simply "voicing opposition".

Agreed. All of those are not voicing opposition, they are simply name calling. Opposition would be best represented by reasoned debate about the drawbacks of a a particular argument or cause. Branding the President a "Marxist" does little to describe the merits or drawbacks of why people may have lost respect for their public leaders, it simply draws attention away from it.

There are those who believe that this name-calling is effective; that it will polarize the population to ignore the work to be done by raising their anger at a paper tiger. What those who engage in this behavior don't see is the simple truth that they are only talking to themselves. A thinking public sees it for what it is ... an attempt to hijack the conversation away from an issue, an issue that the opposition knows it has little honest contrary arguments to make. In essence, to change the topic when they can't logically even compete in an argument, let alone win it.

Look at all of Citizen Kane's questions. None of them promote a solution to a specific problem, and all of them have nothing to do with why it seems many don't respect our President. Nor do they even address the economic, health care or immigrations problems we face. They are all designed to make someone angry, to engage on an emotional level and encourage the redirection of discourse from the topics at hand.

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, bafffle them with bull@!$%#." That seems apt here.

Thank you, Roy and AZPADDY. You certainly speak for me more clearly than I was about to say. I can't add anything to that, CK. Please consider their answers. They are both attempting to show you how to disengage yourself from emotional reasoning to be able to discuss rather than struggle. It's really not about "sides" -- in fact, differing views is the substance. But one must discard the eyeglasses with frosty lenses (and baiting questions) and trade for ones with clear lenses if one expects to see more clearly.

Roy Batty

When extremists arrive armed at president Obama's events, it is beyond simple name calling, it's threatening. For the first time in living memory, the president is loudly and rudely accused - wrongly - of lieing while addressing the nation's elected representatives.

I agree that C.K.'s and other's remarks are sometimes meant as a diversion, they are also an open attack on the president, and all patriotic Americans should stand up and demand a stop to the harassment.

I believe that left unchallenged, these attacks will only escalate to till there is an attempt made on the president's life. The attackers have done all but that. Innocent citizens have already been killed because they were "liberals".

and all patriotic Americans should stand up and demand a stop to the harassment.

That is exactly what they want! On top of that, you upped the rhetoric ante by using the phrase "patriotic Americans." The next fire back will be an argument of what a "real American" is. It won't be long before "Socialist" gets bandied about. Sound familiar?

I believe this kind of escalation is what may lead to kind the undesirable acts we all fear. By challenging we promote the escalation. It is not like at some point after screaming and insults that they will magically go away and say "Well, um, I guess you were right all along...."

They want to divert your attention for their purposes. Don't fall for it. IMHO.

While I believe your opinion has merit, I still think that confronting these attacks is the only way to stop the onslaught. You've read the extremist's comment, and I believe they take a passive approach as weakness, and see that as a "green light" to continue.

I don't expect them to suddenly stop the attacks, but left unchallenged, they will succeed in shifting the debate to their terms. They've done this for 30 plus years, and it's time we put a stop to it.

Look at the cowed media. We no longer have responsible journalism, just "reporters" trying to appear so unbiased that they most often just parrot conservative talking points.

Okay now I've got time to respond to you government hacks here we go:

4. Constant verbal attacks, showing up armed at presidential events, calling the president a liar on national television, referring to the president - daily - as a "socialist", "Marxist", "used car salesman", is a very very far cry from simply "voicing opposition"

Damn right it is and that should tell you just how fed up we are with the BS when even a Congressman will risk his paycheck for a moment to call him by his real name.

1. Who in the world supports corrupt government?

You for one and your parrots storyartist and Roy Batty.

A higher score means less (perceived) corruption

Considering all of Russia, South America, the Middle East, aqnd even Africa (home of the 411 scams) are considered to be LESS corrupt than us I guess you know now where you 3 stand don't you?

2. Who said the constitution is outdated and non-binding?

I asked a question and you have not answered it. Is it or is it not out-dated and non-binding?

Congress is policed by "we the people". Did you vote?

Yes I voted using an electronic voting machine. How about you? Was the vote I cast recorded correctly?

If you're going to debate the issues, use fact and logic.

Been doing nothing but since I started here almost a year ago. How about you? Oh yeah, derision is your forte' not facts. From your recent comments:

Your opinion would make sense.......in a game of poker.

And so on and on and on and on

Now on to your parrots:

Opposition would be best represented by reasoned debate about the drawbacks of a a particular argument or cause.

Been there, doing that. Click on my name, read the articles that pique your interest and feel free to join the fray. I LOVE bringing facts to the table and I've got some really juicy dirt for you Obamanauts on your leader. More to come when you quit crying in the crush of betrayal.

It's really not about "sides" -- in fact, differing views is the substance.

Correct. I and others view the President as the face of a corrupt, unheeding, uncaring, elitist government. This feeling is shared by all political spectrums and we are now fed up to the point we will no longer be silent and wait for the next guy to do better. It's happening on Obamas' watch? Not really. It started with the Patriot Act and like a snowball rolling down the hill has gained size and momentum with each additional outrage. The current financial crises has catapulted the discontent to the forefront as more Americans now have the time off to devote themselves to being heard.

But one must discard the eyeglasses with frosty lenses (and baiting questions) and trade for ones with clear lenses if one expects to see more clearly.

One must discard the rose colored glasses to see their friends and family are suffering at the hands of a corrupt government. If you do not ask the questions you cannot debate the answers.

AZPADDY---

I must agree wholeheartedly with Roy Batty and his quite tangible explanation of how "up-you-one" escalation works -- how each reaction just adds another log on the fire and the fire only grows until it takes over. This language pattern is part of the cycle of violence, which is a downward spiral into the abyss. I understand your inclination to stand up to those who promote hate, and I commend your intentions, but you are going about it as a battle of control, which is always illusion.

I learned my best lessons about this from two women I met who had been thru battered wives recovery. I tried some of the "tools" from their toolbox on my own controlling family members, and it worked! The solution isn't to defeat the other. The solution is for both parties to desire to put the weapons down, and the way to get that to happen is thru the language model that Roy described.

Often that is not possible. I wrote a little theory about that. I called it "You can't communicate with people who don't wear ears." It reminds me to step back from the exchange and realize when I am arguing with myself. This has happened in the above posts. CK's probably a good citizen, good neighbor, and such, but walks thru life wearing no ears. He thinks he does, tho (I'm assuming he's a male). For me, I'm not interested in a "one-upmanship" and I'll just take my "storyartist wanna cracker" and go elsewhere where people respond rather than react.

In battered spouses relationships, when the victim stops arguing, stops engaging back, then the batterer no longer gets the payoff feeling of superiority and shops elsewhere for someone else where the payoff happens. In my own family, I stopped trying to convince, and when the old "I-say-this-then-you-say-that" script started, I stopped and said softly, "I'm sorry, but you're not able to understand." It's like pulling the rug out from under the old fire-stoking dialogue.

Probably CK will go forward carrying all that unaltered negativity to the next anti-Obama topic. But look at the positive posts that happened here, the ones that got stirred up. I thank both of you, Roy Batty and AZPADDY, for your insights and opinions.

how "up-you-one" escalation works -

LoL! she (I'm assuming) says as she compares me a no-eared wife-beater. God I just love the people who preach that others don't listen without even taking the time to read and argue the facts presented. Please do go away; far, far away, like Canada or better yet China since Canada is still to close.

C.K.,

Your derision of our form of government seems odd . You call me and others "Government hacks" as if we are employed as lobbyists for the federal government. You claim to have voted and seem bent on subverting the process that put president Obama in the White House. Obviously, you're among those that see our government as some kind of enemy that needs to be defeated, As I've said before. Al Queda has never had a better friend than those who wish to tear down our form of government. You are no better than a domestic terrorist, and should be treated as such.

Finally, your hatred of president Obama goes far beyond any rational level.

Get a grip, C.K. Your 1.111 and 1.113 comments come off as looney.

You call me and others "Government hacks" as if we are employed as lobbyists for the federal government. You claim to have voted and seem bent on subverting the process that put president Obama in the White House. Obviously, you're among those that see our government as some kind of enemy that needs to be defeated,

No? You do have an account by which you earn income through Newsvine do you not? You also appear to think our current corrupt Government is the best thing since sliced bread and your support of Obama is right here in black and grey. Ergo you are indeed a paid government advocate. When campaign donations influence voting on legislation this is the very definition of corruption. Do you deny this occurs on a regular basis across the board? I would actually have more respect for someone who admits to being employed by the Government. At least I can sympathizes with earning a living in the PR field.

You are no better than a domestic terrorist, and should be treated as such.

Bring on the waterboarding! Hold me for years without bail or consul! Tap my phone! Tap my computer! Ban me from flying! Stop me from buying a gun! All without proof of anything just suspicions or the wrong name.

Wahoo! What a great Government we have!

Finally, your hatred of president Obama goes far beyond any rational level.

Don't know him personally so No, I can't say I hate him; only the corrupt political scene (of which he is the top representative) he represents .

I earn income through NEWSVINE?? Do I get health insurance too?? LOL!

I don't know about anyone else, but I haven't seen a penny from newsvine, nor do I expect to.

I was never a fan of tearing the president down. Not even Dubya. He was our elected leader, and even though I, and the majority of America's voters didn't vote for Bush, I think this level of attack is a dangerous path the Republican party has chosen.

Had I been sitting next to the confederate Wilson, I would have backhanded him across his lieing face., and invited him to further discussion outside.

Well AZPADDY like it or not you have been earning money here. Click on the little black tab at the top that says "Earnings". Donate it or collect it, it's up to you.

He was our elected leader, and even though I, and the majority of America's voters didn't vote for Bush,

Then how did he get in there not once, but twice? Election fraud? Maybe. But admitting that opens the can of worms over whether or not we can trust the Ballot Box and if not what is the next step to removing corruption from government.

Had I been sitting next to the confederate Wilson, I would have backhanded him across his lieing face., and invited him to further discussion outside.

Somehow I have a feeling he may be a bit more familiar with how honest the President actually is than either of us.....

I doubt that. Wilson is the lieing sack O' youknowwhat.

It's common knowledge that Bush didn't get the majority of the popular vote, but he did recieve the majority of the electoral college vote. Nobody showed up with rifles and pistols. Didn't call him a socialist either.

Can you imagine the outcry and BeckPalinMalkinO'ReillyLimbaugh ranting and raving if president Obama didn't get the popular vote??

Come to think of it, the republicans are setting a very bad precedent. They've really got it coming when and if they win the presidency again.

I personally hope our next President is some middle-class University Economics Professor.....

Sitafa,

You sound like Obama should go on SNL with an "I don't get no respect shtick."

Except Rodney Dangerfield was funny.

Obama and his followers are downright scarey, running the country through 40+ unelected czars, supressing free speech, biting off the opposition's fingers, intimidating voters in paramilitary outfits, beating up conservatives, showing up at rallys with semiautomatic weapons etc. In the words of Obama/ Pelosi/ Reid we are "stupid," "NAZIs" and "dumb as table tops."

Not respectful.

Not funny.

I have far more respect for Rodney.

He earned it.

Are you retarded?